[James Pennock]

 
By James O. Pennock and Dave Murphy
The following statement…

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[Anton Dooley]

Some article comments from LinkedIn “Piping Designers” Group Users:

David R

I would say that I am surprised; but, alas I am not. poor practices seem to be multiplying these days and this is only one of a long line of them I have witnessed. There is a true lack of understanding and I chalk it up to a couple of things:

1. Hi we are XYZ tech school come let use help you get a possession as a CAD operator so that you and your family can have the life that you deserve…..

1. In 1982 the oilfield collapsed and in 85 and 86 it sank lower, many of the “Old guys” got out and before things picked back up many of those left died while few if any new people came in to learn from them. Now we have XYZ Tech school teaching them bad habits and few Seniors left who care enough to chastise and embarrass them about their stupidity…

3. Companies that believe anyone can be a piper, “there just isn’t that much to it”, so they hire these folks with diploma’s from XYZ Tech school and put them in charge of a group… We use to refer to them as cubs, now we are forced to call them boss…
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Jayson M

“Now we have XYZ Tech school teaching them bad habits and few Seniors left who care enough to chastise and embarrass them about their stupidity…”

Can’t say as I have ever learned a lesson from either one of those 2 practices being applied to something I had done wrong. If anything it would make me more likely to move away from that “Senior” and any insight they might feel necessary to share.
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David R

Yup, that would be my point. Once upon a time that was how Pipers started, working for guy that had been in the business for a very long time and knew their stuff. Most of the guys I started out with were cranky, irritable, difficult to get along with and they had no tolerance for BS, not all of them; but, many and certainly the really good ones. I owe a great deal to those guys, many are no longer around.
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Jayson M

When I started out I was lucky enough to work with a lot of people who had years of experience and were more then willing to show me the error in my ways, explaining what I had done wrong and the proper way to go about it, without embarrassment or shame Though there were many grumpy old codgers too.
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David R

Generally the same thing. In Houston Texas Pipers had a reputation to uphold and cubs had to earn the respect and prove their metal. If I had to wager I suspect your fortune has a great deal to do with location, specific industry (discipline) and timing. I suspect I have been at it a little longer that you have which as I noted in my original post had a great deal to do with the personalities you ran into in the beginning.
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[Anton Dooley]

Jayson M

14yrs, and I started in Oil & Gas, moved thru Acid & Chemical technologies and now into Mining & Metals.

[Anton Dooley]

I started over 20 years ago, in the (mainly) pharma industry.
My manager at the time, was pretty much as David described … he could be heard shouting everywhere in (and outside) the office.
He had no problem calling you out, and administering a public dressing down if your standards slipped, or weren’t up to scratch in the first place.

Of the group that were juniors alongside me, some progressed and are all good designers. Others fell by the wayside and have pursued other (less) careers.

I despised his attitude, but I always did my best to stay under his radar … the way to do it, was by not messing up.

Questions / advice / help, however were always encouraged.
He always paired up the juniors with experienced senior guys for project exposure and site visits.
And every Friday, when everyone finished early, or got some lucrative overtime – we were hauled down to a conference room (on our own dime) for piping school.

Guess what? I learnt that fittings can be welded together without a pup.
I even found out why we needed a union in a threaded system!

[James Pennock]

David R. & Jayson M.
I like your comments.
Have you both read this?
https://pipingdesigners.com/wp//contents/blog/130-blog-1l-who-is-beauregard-gustafson

[Caroline Conway]

Back in the dark ages when we were still on the boards, I had the good fortune or misfortune of working for a crusty senior who was smart as hell and knew his stuff…I’ll never forget the day he tore a print up in front of me and said, not unkindly, “you can do better”. From that moment on, it was my personal goal to make that just as perfect as I could. He took me under his wing for the two years I worked for that company. A few years later, he saw me working at a pizza joint and told me that I needed to get my backside back into design because I had been good at it.
Fast forward quite a few years…working with a seriously kick-butt engineer…he and I were discussing a system that, due to the requirements, was going to have a bunch of tees and flanges. I designed it with a bunch of weld neck flanges…no spool pieces needed. Dropped the estimated price of the system by quite a bit and made for a much cleaner install.

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