Dike Wall Calculation
- AbhijitN
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13 years 4 months ago - 13 years 4 months ago #5705 by AbhijitN
Replied by AbhijitN on topic Re: Dike Wall Calculation
I have also one more small query in this regard...
Why it is considered that only one tank is going to get failed where as it is always possible that if one tank fails the affect of which can be the failure of other tanks near by????
Pls advice??
Abhijit
Why it is considered that only one tank is going to get failed where as it is always possible that if one tank fails the affect of which can be the failure of other tanks near by????
Pls advice??
Abhijit
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- shrivallabha
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13 years 4 months ago - 13 years 4 months ago #5706 by shrivallabha
Replied by shrivallabha on topic Re: Dike Wall Calculation
I suppose that will be a serious implication from hazard point of view. So I Googled it up:-
Following is better thread with some more links. I recommend you go through it including the links:-
www.cheresources.com/invision/to ... dike-wall/
From the looks of it:
The decision of grouping tanks is not binding one. The tanks can be individually 'bund' (Dike) walled. Individual bund is preferred for large capacity tanks. The grouping decision is a result after studying the hazards (HAZOP, HAZAN) and involves Safety professionals as well. I do not have any FEED or early stage work experience. But I am sure there will be people on this forum who have this type of experience. And they must have participated in those early "formative" stages of plot plan. Probably they'll illuminate us with this activity.
Following is better thread with some more links. I recommend you go through it including the links:-
www.cheresources.com/invision/to ... dike-wall/
From the looks of it:
The decision of grouping tanks is not binding one. The tanks can be individually 'bund' (Dike) walled. Individual bund is preferred for large capacity tanks. The grouping decision is a result after studying the hazards (HAZOP, HAZAN) and involves Safety professionals as well. I do not have any FEED or early stage work experience. But I am sure there will be people on this forum who have this type of experience. And they must have participated in those early "formative" stages of plot plan. Probably they'll illuminate us with this activity.
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- AbhijitN
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13 years 4 months ago - 13 years 4 months ago #5714 by AbhijitN
Replied by AbhijitN on topic Re: Dike Wall Calculation
Pls HELP....!
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- Jop
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13 years 4 months ago - 13 years 4 months ago #5752 by Jop
Do it once and Do it Right
Replied by Jop on topic Re: Dike Wall Calculation
The following questions were asked regarding multi-tank dike areas.
"Why it is considered that only one tank is going to fail where as it is always possible that if one tank fails the affect of which can be the failure of other tanks near by?"
"Why do we use the 110% criteria for sizing containment areas for tanks? I is it more concerned with some CODE? Is that why we take the dike volume as 110% of the largest tank even if the possibility is always there that we can have multiple tanks failed at a time!"
In the United States the Code that applies to Storage Tank location and arrangement (not the design of the tank itself) is:
NFPA 30 Tank Storage and Piping Systems
This code may or may not be used in other parts of the world. That would be a Client/Project decision. If you find that it does apply to you project then your Company or your Project needs to purchase a copy so you and others can read it.
This Code gives guidelines for which types of tanks (Fixed Roof, Floating Roof, etc) and/or which kinds of commodities (Crude Oil, Intermediate Products, Finished Products based on Flash Point, etc) can be located in the same containment area.
The issue of multiple tanks and the consideration for only one might fail: I think this is based on "Law of averages." It must be rare that two tanks in the same containment area would fail at the same time due to natural causes. There is always the possibility of an act of terrorism where multiple tanks might be hit at the same time but I don't think that is the governing factor.
The issue of 110%: The extra 10% is for a concurrent possibility of a massive rain storm and/or a lots of firewater being added to the containment at the same time before the storm drains can be opened to drain off the excess water. Remember the oil will float on top of the rain/fire water.
"Why it is considered that only one tank is going to fail where as it is always possible that if one tank fails the affect of which can be the failure of other tanks near by?"
"Why do we use the 110% criteria for sizing containment areas for tanks? I is it more concerned with some CODE? Is that why we take the dike volume as 110% of the largest tank even if the possibility is always there that we can have multiple tanks failed at a time!"
In the United States the Code that applies to Storage Tank location and arrangement (not the design of the tank itself) is:
NFPA 30 Tank Storage and Piping Systems
This code may or may not be used in other parts of the world. That would be a Client/Project decision. If you find that it does apply to you project then your Company or your Project needs to purchase a copy so you and others can read it.
This Code gives guidelines for which types of tanks (Fixed Roof, Floating Roof, etc) and/or which kinds of commodities (Crude Oil, Intermediate Products, Finished Products based on Flash Point, etc) can be located in the same containment area.
The issue of multiple tanks and the consideration for only one might fail: I think this is based on "Law of averages." It must be rare that two tanks in the same containment area would fail at the same time due to natural causes. There is always the possibility of an act of terrorism where multiple tanks might be hit at the same time but I don't think that is the governing factor.
The issue of 110%: The extra 10% is for a concurrent possibility of a massive rain storm and/or a lots of firewater being added to the containment at the same time before the storm drains can be opened to drain off the excess water. Remember the oil will float on top of the rain/fire water.
Do it once and Do it Right
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- knives
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12 years 8 months ago - 12 years 8 months ago #6251 by knives
Replied by knives on topic Re: Dike Wall Calculation
Sirs,
Hope you can help me with this,
Scenario: 2 Asphalt tanks of same capacity to be placed inside dike area.
Should the dike capacity still needs to be designed to accommodate the equivalent volume for one tank x 1.1 considering asphalt properties in which on the event of spillage it would just harden and mound on itself?
The reason I asked is I want to minimize plot/tank area as possible without getting a very high bund wall. I think that the dike will serve its purpose to initially contain the spillage within the area then allow remaining asphalt to cool down. Should I deviate and design the dike to hold less than that of tank capacity? What would you recommend in this case?
Hope you can help me with this,
Scenario: 2 Asphalt tanks of same capacity to be placed inside dike area.
Should the dike capacity still needs to be designed to accommodate the equivalent volume for one tank x 1.1 considering asphalt properties in which on the event of spillage it would just harden and mound on itself?
The reason I asked is I want to minimize plot/tank area as possible without getting a very high bund wall. I think that the dike will serve its purpose to initially contain the spillage within the area then allow remaining asphalt to cool down. Should I deviate and design the dike to hold less than that of tank capacity? What would you recommend in this case?
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- Jop
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12 years 8 months ago - 12 years 8 months ago #6202 by Jop
Do it once and Do it Right
Replied by Jop on topic Re: Dike Wall Calculation
knives,
You did not say where your project is located. So I am going to base my recommendation on a USA location.
Two or more tanks: The Dike area capacity shall be 1.1 times the volume of the larger tank plus the displaced volume of any other tank(s) only to the height of the proposed Dike.
To assist you in Tank & Dike calculations there are tools on this web site. Look under the "Tools" button and go to "Equipment section. There are two items you should review and consider using whenever you have a Tank/Dike situation.
You did not say where your project is located. So I am going to base my recommendation on a USA location.
Two or more tanks: The Dike area capacity shall be 1.1 times the volume of the larger tank plus the displaced volume of any other tank(s) only to the height of the proposed Dike.
To assist you in Tank & Dike calculations there are tools on this web site. Look under the "Tools" button and go to "Equipment section. There are two items you should review and consider using whenever you have a Tank/Dike situation.
Do it once and Do it Right
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